Since The Breach dropped down I noticed that the ranged and some melee enemy types have very poor AI implementation in which they enter into a “Input Reading” state in which the player needs to waste their turn to attack or wait 20-60 seconds for the enemy to actually snap out of that mode and attack so the combat can continue. An example of this:
I started recording this video after 20 seconds waiting for the boss to do something, it gave me enough time to open OBS and record. If the player press the attack button, the enemy will do a backdash to trap the player but this is a bad implementation and breaks the combat flow completely unless the player is willing to waste his turn.
A similar situation happens with the bosses’ long combos (5-6 hits sometimes) to catch the players. Those are not fun and again they break the combat flow as the player needs to wait for the long combo to finish multiple times in a fight and became annoying instead of exciting.
I understand that Moon wants for NRFTW to be hard just for the sake of it by taking From Software games as a model. But I rather be happier with an original combat implementation than a similar one from the FS games, specially because those stupid delayed attacks in which you can stand up and go out to walk your dog just to come back and the enemy is still charging his move.
To Moon devs, make your game hard all you want but make it fair for the players and don’t rely on cheap “mechanics” that looks stupid and break all the pace of the combat.
Don’t waste time. He and another guy spend their time on these forums and spamming Thomas on twitter about how braindead easy the game is and how their life is ruined that the unwashed masses are enjoying THEIR game.
There are plenty of people expressing their concern with how the game has become a button masher to appease the likes of you. If you bothered reading anything that doesn’t align with your snowflake way of life, you’d know better.
If you have the right to express your braindead opinions, and bootlick and grovel every time they post something, I don’t see why others are not allowed to express their disgust.
This game and what it turns into has no bearing on my life, but you shall always remain an obsequious peon in your life ahead
And the next time you’re going to try and insult me with some backhanded comment, it’d be great if you had the gall to address me directly instead being the weasel that you are.
@VGShrine in the video you can see the auto-target dot disappearing as the character moves (presumably auto-targeting disabled) and you can see the boss charging his attack just before the character attacks. They just didn’t connect. No input reading.
@VictorvanCleef in the video there is no input reading action from the enemy as I had to wait around 35 seconds for the boss to snap out of that mode. When an enemy enters to Input Reading mode it won’t attack you and won’t do anything for a while because it’s programmed to “react” to your attack input to do his trick move and backdash and counter attack the player.
The outcome of this Input Reading state is:
If the player recognize the enemy pattern and knows it entered in Input Reading mode, the player can stop attacking and the enemy will continue in that state for a while until snaps out of it. This is the scenario from the video, that’s why the boss changed his animation to a scream to attack me first when snapped out of that state after almost 35 seconds waiting for me to waste my turn.
When the enemy enters in the Input Reading state if the player attacks (waste his turn) the enemy will do his trick move to backdash and counter attack.
Hope that explains better the situation. You can replicate this enemy behavior with all ranged enemies and this particular boss.
I don’t know if input reading exists, because I’m not a developer.
But the fact that you waited unfortunately proves nothing. A good boss shouldn’t constantly attack, but also react, and as I already said, he charged his attack before you attacked.
A boss that reacts and sometimes waits to react is no proof for input reading, sorry.
@VictorvanCleef I’ve encountered this situation as well… is kinda strange, but I don’t necessarily dislike it (it helps break the pattern on encounters)… now input reading is a different thing, and I dislike it, but also do believe is present, even if not for all enemies or move sets…
but also it doesn’t disproves it, input reading relies on showing both the input and the reaction of the enemy for proper proving… but having a waiting state and input reading helps more easily identify input reading for the simple fact of slowing things down…
and just to be very clear, when programing reactions input reading is probably the easiest system to implement and not necessarily a bad thing, but it is bad if players can perceive it because feels like “being cheated”, especially when the results are unmitigable DMG being received…
But the fact that the enemy starts its attack before the character attacks is an indication that not much input reading was used. (At least in my opinion, the enemy starts too early for input reading.)
And yes, there is probably some input reading in the game (and I don’t particularly like it), but I don’t think it’s excessive in NRftW either.
oh but that’s exactly what I mean, without having any information on the player’s input relative to the enemy’s action there’s no way for us to tell either way just by watching some footage…
nevertheless, you are missing an important point he made:
and:
the footage shows the “wait mode”, but as he explains, it doesn’t show the “input reading” attack because he disengages which snaps the enemy out of “wait mode” back into regular “fighting mode”, and that’s when the enemy actually attacks…
but I’ve experienced myself instances where enemies attack as I perform an action (usually an attack), coincidences might happen, but if you play long enough you will probably be able to tell either way and is usually when foes enter the state @VGShrine describes on the OP…
it is there and is a fact, now, how often does this happens and is it good or bad? well, those are different questions and kinda subjective…
