I played this game for like 1-2 weeks and already saw many incredible problems, which i cant understand how they made it even into the game.
Bosses shouldnt be staggerable, i litterally farm the crucible boss with dual wield daggers from blacksmith lvl 2, and he cant even stand up and fight back. Its ridiculous and ive never seen this in a game.
Nerf the damage and health of the bosses and give them more phases with aoe areas to avoid and stuff like that, so it becomes alil bit challanging.
Nerf the damage of some builds and echoes in general.
Remove the stats “focus gain on dmg” its destroying the whole game.
I remember 2 things from ur first trailer, you advertised with the combat and focus system and the clearity of the bossfights. But in reality you did the exact opposite, showing me you have no clue what ur talking about. You said you dont want people to spam certain attacks from close or distance, thats why u introduced focus for all classes. So all classes have to engage in close combat with regular attacks to gain focus and then use those powerful rune attacks. But in reality you can not only gain focus from any distance, but also spam rune attacks 24/7.
Its ridiculous. Make the rune attacks stronger but make focus gain much slower and only gainable through auto attacks and without any stats which increase focus gain. Mayble only “focus gain %” but not “focus gain on damage”.
And make the boss fights clearer, because in many situations i cant see what happening, because all animations in this game are so wild which make them hard to read and on top of it, your character and enemies are being pushed arround and on top of that the fights are floated with effects. The exact opposite of ur advertisment.
Remove the stat “item weight decrease” and “carry weight increase”.
They remove the entire gear balance. They are way to strong with heavy gear and way to weak with light gear. You said you dont want transmogs, because you want players to identify builds through appearances, but again you did the exact opposite. Now most players run heavy armor, but still are in the light or medium weight class. Which makes the light armor too weak and destroys the point of armor classes and decision making.
Remove the stat “armor increase” because its simply too strong with plate armor and too weak with light armor. Which makes balancing almost impossible.
Give dual wield and two handed weapons double the stat buffs for fair balance.
Remove the pushing of enemies when hitting them. Half of my attacks miss, because the enemy is being pushed back after the first hit. And then they fall down edges and my character falls down with them in the attack animation. Which leads to the other problem, disable falling from edges while attacking. Like elden ring did. I simply cant attack enemies near edges.
Increase the backstab range, because ur animations are so bad that i cant tell where the back is and its changing during their animations.
So either fix the animations which is alot of work, or simply increase the range by alot. like up to 150 degrees behind the enemy.
I probably forgot some things and add them later on. I hope you change these things and dont waste all ur efforts into the game. Because i dont think that most players would like the state of the combat in this game. Only the mindless ones.
“Bosses shouldnt be staggerable, i litterally farm the crucible boss with dual wield daggers from blacksmith lvl 2, and he cant even stand up and fight back. Its ridiculous and ive never seen this in a game.”
I mean posture breaking is already an accepted and balanced thing in souls likes. Just because currently its easily overwhelmed with certain setups doesn’t make it bad by design, but rather untuned. There really hasn’t been much of a balance pass yet so i would expect this to be fixed in the next few major content patches.
“Remove the stats “focus gain on dmg” its destroying the whole game.”
I kind of agree here, it definitely feels like the crucible should allow this kind of focus spam gameplay through boons, but currently you can achieve it outside the crucible quite easily with the right enchants and infusions. Especially when pvp comes along, this will show itself to be a little bit game design breaking.
“And make the boss fights clearer, because in many situations i cant see what happening, because all animations in this game are so wild which make them hard to read and on top of it, your character and enemies are being pushed arround and on top of that the fights are floated with effects. The exact opposite of ur advertisment.”
I also agree here, it becomes noticeable with a lot of specific boons (thunder strikes boon is such a massive offender here)
Another way the clarity is lacking is vs certain camera angles. When a Nith Giant goes for a kick when hes facing away from the camera, you cant see his only tell (raised leg) because its obscured by the camera. They could modifiy some animations to fix this.
They will definitely need to do a animation pass to increase some visual clarity in certain situations.
“Remove the stat “armor increase” because its simply too strong with plate armor and too weak with light armor. Which makes balancing almost impossible.”
Yes Armor Damage Reduction and equip loads need to have a balance pass also. With the right enchants you can basically wear full plate and barely need any points in equip load, allowing you to dump more points in damage and health. You don’t sacrifice much to do this at all. With 40% reduced weight and 20% increased equip load on full plate, you can basically be running around at the same equip as someone with unenchanted cloth. Sure it isn’t easy to roll that on all 4 plate items, but its a bit game breaking if you do. (although 4x infusions on a high roll plate Armor chest is a better option)
“Remove the pushing of enemies when hitting them. Half of my attacks miss, because the enemy is being pushed back after the first hit. And then they fall down edges and my character falls down with them in the attack animation. Which leads to the other problem, disable falling from edges while attacking. Like elden ring did. I simply cant attack enemies near edges.”
I’m a bit torn on this one. I was killing myself all the time before too, but with some restraint I’ve learned to chant the types of attacks i do vs enemies on edges, most weapons have a move set that will give you a good attack vs an opponent on the edge. Personally like the challenge of making a character chose moves carefully on precipices’, but i can understand the frustration others might have with it so its an either way thing for me.
“Increase the backstab range, because ur animations are so bad that i cant tell where the back is and its changing during their animations.
So either fix the animations which is alot of work, or simply increase the range by alot. like up to 150 degrees behind the enemy.”
Eh, its a skill you get used to. I land backstabs all the time now. It probably could be slightly buff radius but 180 would be too much, backstabs are broken as is.
please no! that is not making it more challenging, that is artificial difficulty. it does not make the boss more challenging because it has challenging moves or player input reading or great combat choreography, it just adds more nuisances.
i never will understand who those people are who enjoy boss arenas full of poison, bullet hell bosses that spam a quintillion of projectiles or bosses that are just sponges, take 0.1 dmg and perma stagger you with elemental bullshit.
more phases, more aoe and more bullshit in the arena does not make a boss better or challenging. what really makes busses fun and challenging are nice choreographed attack patterns. thigs u can learn and work with. you can not learn a poison pool and work with it, u can just wait it out and run to the farthest corner in the arena. thats just lame. you need attacks that are hard do deal with, but when u manage to dodge i get a punish window. thats what makes fromsoft bosses like lady maria, rellana, friede, artorias etc. so great.
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more phases, more aoe and more bullshit in the arena does not make a boss better or challenging. what really makes busses fun and challenging are nice choreographed attack patterns. thigs u can learn and work with. you can not learn a poison pool and work with it, u can just wait it out and run to the farthest corner in the arena. thats just lame. you need attacks that are hard do deal with, but when u manage to dodge i get a punish window. thats what makes fromsoft bosses like lady maria, rellana, friede, artorias etc. so great.
Yeah i think really the bosses just need the right tuning. All those bosses you meantioned wouldnt be nearly as great if every second hit staggered them. Theres a reason Melania takes 3 parries to stagger, fromsoft wanted you to have to deal with her full moveset, multiple times.
The echo knight as fine as is, as long as it takes you about 3-5 mins to kill him. The nature of stacking a build with a crazy lucky boon streak, is that sometimes it takes 10 seconds. That’s all fixed with tuning, not a boss redesign.
You can bully Echo Knight easely atm. The reason however is not his weak poise defence, but the ability to spam rune attacks back to back. The main culprit is the “Gain Focus % on damage dealt” enchantment, as it allows for multi-hit rune attacks to gain all the spent focus back and creates a loop. “Increased Focus gain” enchantment could also be cut in half or only be limmited to certain gear slots, like weapons, rings and gloves.
The same goes for all gain % on damage dealt effects, stamina as well as health. Those enchantments allow to bypass game resource management, so that the combat goes from souls like to action.
The next big thing is the “overall speed” enchantment. It should not come back for purple gear and only be limmited to certain gear like the Willow Ring. It is just too powerfull.
I also agree with the light vs. heavy armor depiction. Not only is it extremely easy to equip heavy gear, but cloth armor is just at natural disadvantage. Any +armor or weight related enchantments are not effective on lighter armor, thus act as a filler. Additionally there are no benefits to go light weight in the first place.
light armor in elden ring was mainly for some of the armor bonuses. Without meaningful bonuses there is little reason to go light. The light dodge just isnt impactful enough in the current game. Pvp may be different. What would be interesting to see is some of the more sought after effects that would allow people to increased ranged damage to a competant level, being moved to a “light armor only effect” For example, many of trhe stamina return and rune generation effects would not exist or be infusable on plate armor.
Culprit, sure but making focus even less obtainable is another problem. If you limit the way your describing it nerfs all focus generation. Little difference between that and just removing focus on from the game.
Honestly if not for rune abilities to mix up the combat I’d be done with this game after trying it once. I have no interest in a hack n slash. As fun as Elden Ring was for the story and agreeable combat its not the kind of game I want to play over and over, personally.
If the issue is poise constantly being broken, they could introduce a timer so that after CC a targets poise bar can not take damage for X seconds. And/or reduce the amount of poise damage multi hit abilities do in calculation.
If focus gain from multi hit attacks is the problem, why not just reduce the number of hits in certain skills or have a reduce the amount of focus generated per hit with multi hit runes.
There’s plenty of ways to deal with this without destroying focus use overall.
In addition. What kind of balance are we talking about here? This is not a live service ARPG. It’s not PoE, Diablo, etc. This game hits on more of an Elden Ring, LoZ:Windwaker, borderlands, type class in terms of beginning to end. There are always elements of games that out perform other options.
In multiplayer that’s an issue but in a game like this? Idk like don’t play that way if you think it’s an issue?
And before someone says but the game is multiplayer it has pvp coming! Yep and it’s gonna be shit. First off let’s stick with the Elden Ring example, what’s the comet ray channel thing that 100-0 just about anything in the game with the MP flask up? That shit sucks ass in pvp, ok. So multiplayer cares about balance of course but balance is relative to how useful it is in each setting.
That’s the problem. Aside from the fact that top down pvp has no market share… I e been there. Bloodline champs, battlerite, lost ark, etc… they all fail because no one wants to play them (I did but just speaking in general here the games all have abysmal player bases, ded game).
How good something is will always depend on the situation in which you intend to use it. For this reason balance between single player and multiplayer are a laughable concept in a game like Wicked.
So if it’s just single player, you could just not play with that ability if you don’t find it enjoyable.
That said I think it would be great to have a well rounded game, not a balanced one.
Balance implies equality; however we know from literally everything single game that some things are better than others in the construct they were created with. It just comes with the territory.
Take GW2 one of the worse ideas to come from a dev team. “We want get rid of the holy Trinity from GW1 and so now, any class can support, any class can DPS, any class can…”
Laughable. Every classes version of a heal skill, DPS skill, etc created huge power gaps. They took a step back from the holy Trinity only to add the same meta right back in the game. Wild.
The only equality you’ll enjoy in life is how you treat others with respect across the board, without prejudice. We won’t get it in a game because the customization that we crave inherently creates imbalances!!!
So which one do you want. A balanced game which no developer has ever delivered. Or for it to be fun? Also it’s an ARPG so play how you see fit.
@Kenna I would also say that light weight offers no advantages worth investing and needs a revisit. As for heavy vs light armor; armor class unique enchantments could be a possible solution. Or another idea is to scale enchatntment values based on the armor type: cloth > … > heavy.
@BowUser There must be a middle ground between no rune uses and currently possible rune spam. NRFTW cought my attention because the game marketet itself not as a run-of-the-mill ARPG. I argue from the standpoint that combat mechanics and resource management should matter, especially during a boss fight,
Even after all the nerfs to said enchantment it still generates way to much Focus. The idea to reduce the hit count on certain runes is akin to treating the symptoms, not the problem. Rune attacks do not generate Focus btw. it was removed a few patches ago; only the enchantment allows Focus generation on rune use. The main issue is that you don’t require anything elso besides this enchantment (found on a gem) and like 200 Focus pool to spam runes. This is not a heavy investment into a build to provide such results.
The suggested solution to poise is also overcomplicated for a simple problem.
Personally, I think PVP is a waste of resources here. That said, balance should matter, even for a single player game. Fun is a subjective thing and it is hard to evaluate who’s version of fun is more important. In the end it will be a bow down to majority for profit reasons.
Agree but not to the extent focus orientated builds are unplayable. I can gas myself out of resources with 400 focus, 140 focus gain, 2 focus regen, 9 focus on focus use, easily if I’m not managing resources. Note this is also in crucible with additional buffs… Weapons sets I’ve played with the most are Bow/Knife and Great sword. Neither weapon set is plagued for the additional on hit. They’re both white with just the infusion.
The infusion on pants? It still very much works.
Sure about that? Low cost runes, sure. It’s not universal. Here’s two EK fights. Trying to combo with runes will 100% run you out of resources. We are not forced to play with plagued items. You’re proposing a balance change based on a single possible enchantment. Since when are ARPG’s about forcing one way to play?
Like I said I hate hack n slash (basically just repetitive one button type shit). So I’ve been looking to build around combos.
IMO the much healthier discussion is about rune cost. If you take a shit on rune resource management to the point they’re not usable then what’s the point.
On the weapon you get 2% from gem and additional 3% from enchantment, can be a blue one. Then you get additonal 5% from a torch for a total of 10% of max Focus on damage dealt. That’s 20 Focus per damage instance with a max pool of 200. Piercing Flurry or Twirl Dash hit 7 times per rune use. 7x20=140. You can easely adjust Focus pool if you intend to use less sources of “Focus on damage dealt” or the rune does less hits.
In this thread the very first entry showcases exactly what I mean:
With your bow build you should be able to spam Cone Shot, as you get all the focus back, even with the 30% extra cost from echoes.
The endresult could be something like this:
Lmfao! Thats the point!!! I can, I don’t have to or want to… Fix multi hits don’t shit on focus across the board. That means the ONLY thing you can use is multi hits if you keep nerfing focus into the ground.
Holy fucking shit you actually have me sideways.
I’m so fucking lost here my friend. I explain to you that multi hit skills are the issue, not focus generation.
I show you videos using 100 focus single hit attacks and weaving them between autos… And your response is, Yay but multi hit skills are strong.
Like! Are we serious? I already said they are. Adjust the cost of skills, adjust the multi hit generation! If you make it so every skill in the game needs 7 hits to sustain them what’s the fucking point let’s all just mindlessly spin on the boss and stun lock it. Fun…
Edit:
And to make it worse in the response prior you said fixing multi hit was too complicated for a simple problem. Oh my I’m so… Are you serious. Please tell me you’re just messing with me. Please, please please
Okey. Let’s brainstorm and fix multi hit runes without nerfing “Focus on damage dealt” enchantment. I will include suggestions you provided so far. (I will refer to Piercing Flurry in all examples).
Rune cost increased from 100 to 150. With the setup I mentined earlier you just have to increase max Focus to 250 to chain spam. Rune cost increased from 100 to 200. With the setup I mentined earlier you just have to increase max Focus to 300.
Going any higher is silly as the rune becomes unatractive outside this setup.
Number of hits reduced. With the setup I mentined earlier you would have to go from 7 hits to 4 hits to not break even. In case of only 4 hits - increase max Focus to 250 to chain spam.
Reduce the number of hits even further and you lump all multi hit runes together and make them indistinguishable. Not to mention…increase max Focus to be able to chain spam.
Reduced the amount of Focus generated per hit with multi hit runes. Done already. Runes do not generate Focus innate to weapon stats. Only enchantments allow Focus generation, like “Gain Focus on damage dealt” but I am not allowed to touch it.
Focus on damage dealt scales from the damage and not max Focus pool. This turns Focus pool into a dump stat. Furthermoire, the ammount of damage we can deal would result in an overall buff to Focus gains.
The whole attack chain is considdered as one damage instance and triggers the enchantment only once.
Now there is a special rule, an exception, for certain runes that has to be communicated somehow with the player base. Such special rules are not transparant to the player. Special rules overcomplicate general game mechanics. Special rules create weakpoints in design and are the main cause of outliers. Still, this would be my highest common denominator.
You can add more ideas.
And I explain that “Focus on damage dealt” enchantment is the issue, not the runes.
It was with regards to your poise solution.
Multi hit runes do not deal massive poise damage on their own. However, if you chain them it adds up and you can easely poise break EK. Thus, the issue is not that multi hit runes deal massive poise damage, but their spam. Said spam is a result of brocken Focus economy.
The first part with the timer punishes legit stun builds. It also introduces another unclear/non-transparent rule. The second part is acceptable, however it misses the point that poise break comes from rune spam. This makes your suggestion overcomplicated, because you either need special rules/mechanics or you treat the symptoms and not the problem.
All that said, all the time I was talking about overachievers, yet there are some things that require a buff. That would be innate Focus gain on most 2H weapons. The innate Focus gain value can go as low as 5, which is not acceptable given the slow attack speed 2H weapons have. It needs to be at least double digits.
Not at all. If done properly this is simply about protecting the “integrity” or intent of a fight. I believe it’s a good design choice to not enforce any additional constraints on the players. (as a general rule of thumb).
However, if players are able to ignore all mechanics of a fight I believe there is room to soften these interactions. There is no reason a proper stun build wouldn’t have a target more CC’d than a build not set up to do so.
For the same reason, take freeze. Do you believe that if I build cold damage instead of poise I should be rewarded by perma freezing a boss?
Personally I don’t believe that any specialization should come at the cost of the games feel. Don’t get me wrong, I want to build into a particular theme/strategy and see it be effective but there needs to be limits to just how effective any build is, otherwise it seriously undermines the players experience, imo.
I believe this can be handled by creating some balance in the stats available to the players; however like I said before the more customization you have, the more “odd forks” you’ll create. A seemingly unintended path (path being designed by the developers) and players going, yeah but what if I sacrifice X stat to build only into Y.
In doing so Players will inadvertently circumvent the balance of the game (enemy health bars are typically designed based on how much damage the designer expects a player to be capable of putting out). Therefore design elements are created (mechanics) that a player is forced to interact with, in order for the designers to attempt some level of control in an engagement… despite the players seeking to be as strong as possible.
Don’t believe me. @D&D Dungeon Masters. Any lurkers wanna chime in? Examples of this in the Crucible would be the phase 2 dive bomb, and phase 2 sword spike. Both of which are capable of 100-0’ing players if they do not: dodge or CC the EK. These are great design choices imo because they are soft counters. Regardless of build, a players skill can allow them to continue to play how they like (risk vs reward). I love soft counters in games, they end up playing out as a real time rock v. paper v. scissor.
Imo hard counters in an ARPG are shitty for the most part. You want to encourage build diversity so forcing interactions with hard counters take away from ARPGs.
Ok so why is this novel I’ve written relevant? Because I’m trying to tell you… for good reason… players should, and will find ways around any soft counters you throw at them with time. Some players faster than others, this is the nature of a skill check.
But how does this tie in? There will be OP builds, combinations, items, etc. You can NOT balance a game around top end stats only. That applies to focus as well.
To me a great game allows for these things while trying to RIP anyone bold enough to isolate their stats to push their builds to extremes. When you give a player limited resources to customize a build there are bound to be players who pool those resources in one point; therefore their: damage, survivability, CC, etc are far beyond the design of the enemy.
A stun build can still be great and generate more CC than average builds without breaking open the game.
Ok… we made it to the numbers, almost… bear with me here. Lets grab the frost example again. The idea that you can build ice/frost damage generally implies some kind of chill and/or frozen mechanics come alongside it. Wicked is no different. Ice/Frost deals less damage than other elemental boons but offers a crowd control effect. Not a bad trade off.
Ok so how do you freeze an enemy. By dealing X amount of cold damage. Based on my time in game I believe this to be %HP related based on the target.
So if I’m building for Ice/Frost damage I’m getting two benefits here. The added elemental damage + CC mechanic. Now the damage is just always there and if I wanted to do the most damage possible I wouldn’t be using Ice/Frost now would I? We already covered it does less damage than it’s corresponding elements because it has a built in CC mechanic to go along with it.
So… lets assume I want to freeze a target. Great. How do I accomplish this goal? Well in Wicked, since it’s caused by dealing X amount of damage to a target I’d want to maximize my damage! You can see where this could be a slippery slope because we talked previously about how players will often build to maximize certain stats. And then you combine a CC mechanic based on damage, you’re already incentivizing players to build as much damage as possible so they can get their added benefit. Otherwise just pick a different element, yeah?
If you made it this far… bless you, it’s all coming together now…
So if I build purely for damage so I can freeze my opponent we still haven’t answered how I do damage.
Ok. So in Wicked we can deal Ice/Frost damage by:
Weapon attacks (with cold damage baked in)
Rune attacks (that deal cold damage or with cold baked in)
Baked in implies additive effects to neutral attacks and runes. In order to add elemental damage to neutral attacks and runes you need one of two things (as they do not stack). An enhancement rune… that’ll be Cold in our case. Or a weapon coating.
Now that we’ve established how we do damage we can chat about the resources needed to DO the damage I’ve been taking 20 years to talk about.
Weapon attacks, that’s easy. Stamina is the resource needed to attack.
Runes, that’s a bit messier. They require Focus…
While Stamina requirements vary from weapon to weapon, it’s not as dramatic as focus. Especially when you consider how many more modifiers their are for generating Focus as opposed to Stamina.
But this tracks with the design choices of the developers. We have limits to the amount of damage buffs we can choose from to augment our damage.
Now these buffs augment our damage from attacks and runes both (currently). So doesn’t this just mean runes are inherently stronger than auto attacks? Not quite. But yes, some are extremely powerful because they do greater than 100% damage. I’m sure we will have more examples later on, but there are weapons that deal pure elemental damage like Falling Sky and Spirit Edge. Given the rate of attack speed these can be fantastic when combined with elemental runes to produce your elemental effect but generally not strong enough on their own in a short duration (depending on the target).
So attacks compliment runes and runes compliment attacks… Oh shit we consume stamina to generate focus with attacks! It’s almost like that was… intentional…
Point being in all this is that runes gets a lot of hate for now powerful they are without people taking into consideration how the play alongside weapon attacks. Both compliment each other and I think its a great system. I wouldn’t want to see a strictly auto attack style game thrust on us.
@ShortCat jump to here…
So stamina limits attacks, and rune attacks are limited by focus. Lets stick to focus sense that’s the hot topic.
Focus can be gained/modified by: (let me know if I missed one)
Weapon attacks as outlined in the item description & weapon parries (not directly mentioned…)
The only issue with focus economy is multi hit generation. Not % focus gain on damage. If focus gain continues to be nerfed when there is literally only one standing issue in the games focus generation. That’s a problem. All that does punish single hit runes.
So why did I spend hours monologuing something I’ve spoken about on several other posts. Because I only gave the bullets above and I’m just going to link this shit from now on. Thanks for coming to my TedTalk…
As for
Using cone shot, 400 focus build. The only difference now is that you rely on the multi hit generation only. Again that’s the problem.
I swear on whatever you consider holy that I don’t have the glove infusion. No clue if this is a bug but…
As for
Same logic as focus gain. If it’s still a problem after multi-hit focus generation then give it some kind of cap. That’s all a timer is… Doesn’t have to be a long timer. Just not, 100-0 enemy can’t move.
@BowUser thanks for the novel , it was a great read. I agree with 90% of it. The part I disagree most is this:
As I see it, top end builds push the design to its breacking point and sometimes even further beyound. Thus they have to be adressed first, ideally without causing damage to less optimised strategies players use.
My understand of balance is that you hammer down all outliers first, at the top as well as at the bottom. You work at the bottom to ensure great variety in available strategies; you work at the top to ensure said variety actually matters.
Just a small insert to cross-check our findings on elemental effects.
From my observations elemental effects trigger when an enemey takes ~45% of its total HP as elemental damage. I could never freeze EK more than twice. This means outside of pure elemental weapons or elemental runes status effects are unattractive.
I did not test the effect of mixing several elements on an enemy and how it influences the individual status threshold. I also did not test the new “Elemental potency” enchantment.
Well said.
Neither do I want to see a pure auto attack (AA) playstyle. Yet I also think being able to use a rune after only 2 AAs is too much. While being able to chain spam runes is borderline ARPG teritorry. I see runes as tactical maneuvers, as special moves. There is just nothing tactical or special if players can use them frequently.
This does not mean cheap & spamable runes should not exist; runes that build the baseline and anchor the mechanic should not be spamable though. My baseline is 100 Focus cost.
As far as I know:
“Focus Regeneration” grants ~1,5 Focus per second per regen source
“Increased Focus gain” improves the innate Focus generation on AA based on the stats listet in weapon UI. It used to influence other Focus sources but it was patched out.
“Focus % gain on damage dealt” scales only from the number of damage instances as well as max Focus pool. It used to work differently but it was changed at that time Patch Notes - Early Access Patch 1
Patch notes only mention “nerfed”, but with this patch the % was lowered and scaling from “Focus gain increased” was removed.
I even tested it again to varify: I died to 0 my Focus. Equiped gear with as much “Focus gain inceased” as I could ( 170%) and weapon +torch with “Focus on damage dealt” (7%). Drunk a potion to execute a rune. Killed a crab. Marked Focus gained from the enchantment. Died to 0 Focus again. Removed armor except the ring to maintain the same Focus pool and killed a crab again. Focus gained from the hit was the same.
This part is not correct. We have a different footing for this discussion and talk past each other.
The absolut brain dead thing in the game is, that innate Focus gain on weapons can vary between 5 and 10. For all weapon types except Dual Daggers, those vary beween 3 and 5 but just hit twice. That’s why Dual Daggers and some faster 1H weapons can generate Focus like crazy, while most 2H weapons feel so slow in this regard.
This is one of the complaints OP had and I support this view.
Absolutely. What I was trying to get at is that OP builds will exist the more customization we have, and depending on the severity -caps are the only tool I’m aware of that done have a trickle down effect. A cap lets you isolate the part of the interaction that is OP and control it’s final effectiveness. Unfortunately, caps are all too often used to make something just terrible. Capping things too low is also poor design.
I have, it just increases elemental damage by that percentage. I kinda like it, since it’s blue you’re trading other utility stars for damage.
I believe this is on the verge of gatekeeping. Don’t get me wrong the game intrinsically has a style and you can interpret that to say that chaining runes shouldn’t be possible. But I disagree, I believe players should be able to play how they want and picking up where I spoke about evaluating rune damage and focus cost. I don’t think every rune needs a huge modifier. I don’t see the harm in a bunch of 50-75 cost skills that do a little less damage than they do now.
If there was some consistency between skill cost and damage/utility like I suggested I think this problem solved itself and would be healthy for the game overall.
But I think we’re on a similar page here. There needs to be some continuity in skill cost and value of the rune.
Maybe it’s the focus weapon gain from the weapon. I’ll try your test method tonight.
I take no issue with the statement that attacking quickly with the 2% focus on damage delt is strong. That’s what I’ve been saying all along…
The thing is if you cripple that infusion it’s a problem for all builds and doesn’t fix quick hits at all.
That’s why I suggested reducing the number of hits. But maybe an ICD on the infusion and enchantment is in order. Keeps it strong just not spammy… Something like 0.5 sec or 0.75. would need to be play tested to find the sweet spot.
i dont like those aoe phases of bosses either, but its better than the current boss fights. we saw that the game is too easy, no matter what kind of attacks the enemies have. So i doubt that they will make the fights better through better attack patterns and the attack animations are so wild, that they are hard to read anyway. which makes it less skill based. unlike in soulsgames. the aoe phases were just one example, but i actually dont care what they do as long as it gets better. but somehow i think aoe attacks would actually make this game better, if its not too much that u just have to go into a corner. but if they change all the other points ive mentioned, than the boss fights would automaticly be better. right now u can just skipp all the attacks and damage of the boss, by simply stagger and rune spam him.
I have boomer reflexes, and I have only killed EK with pure luck. I have 2x30lv characters, one with slow 2-h sword, and other with falling sky mage staff.
I guess staggering is easy with very fast weapons, but at least for other specs the bosses offer still some challenge.
yes, thats why i said they should remove stagger and focus, stamina, health gain on damage dealt and then nerf bosses, so it becomes balanced and skillbased. but also remove decrease item weight, increase weight capacity and increase armor, to balance also the weight classes. game has alot of potential, but its at a very poor state right now. these things are no brainers…
@ShortCat
Re tested… idk how I was getting the numbers I was on Ice Ram before. Just tried with auto attacks, and three different runes. I confirm the 1.5/s on regen in this testing and this is my conclusion:
Focus Regeneration (~1.5 focus per second per affix)
Focus Gain increased by X (Modifies focus gain by weapon attacks (and possible parries, I don’t know why we get so much focus on parry. possibly it’s % based per parry and not affected by focus gain) ONLY, see weapon for base focus gain)
Focus increased by X (increases overall focus pool)
Focus Increased by X at Low Health (focus increased by X at low health
Gain X Focus on Focus Use (gain fixed amount of focus per focus use)
Increased Focus by X for 20 Seconds after Parry (increases focus pool for 20 seconds after successful parry)
Gain X Focus on Kill (gain focus on kill)
Gain X Focus on Parry (gain focus on successful parry)
Gan X% Focus on Damage dealt (gain percentage of total focus pool per damage dealt. Multiplied by number of successful hits)
I did calcs in excel for the expected value after a hit with the exact focus needed to attack available (potion method as you described) and then timed with focus regen against the total focus pool. Every single time I got the same result.
Suppose I got there in the wrong way but I’m sticking to multi hit being the only issue here. Not the affix focus gain on damage delt itself.
The only reason this skill on the current patch still gets more focus than the skill cost is that you can get at a minimum 4% on 8 hits. Combine that with a large focus pool and you’re set to spam.
If it was removed to balance multi hit… I think we’d definitely need adjustments to rune cost (more so than we already do) and two handed weapons would need some buffs to focus gain to help mitigate the discrepancy between one handed weapons with faster attack animations.
Rune damage overall I believe is too high but that’s a novel for another time.
, it was a great read. I agree with 90% of it. The part I disagree most is this: